In Depth 202 wiring diagrams?

[Pagz]

After spending ages this morning staring aimlessly into the bay...and of course trying to use the force many times...it was apparent the ECU wasnt about to jump in there and wire itself...

My haynes manual has a few basic diagrames but its far short of what i need..

The question is does MB or any other have drawings that show the relationship between ASR,ABS,the cluster to ECU wiring and weather or not the ECU runs a can bus with the cluster...

Iv looked on wirediagram.comhttp://www.wirediagram.com/linkpage/...nformation.htm
because i live outside of the US there is no option to purchase the prescription so i can tell just how detailed these drawings are,has anybody used them before?

Does anyone know of anywhere else i could obtain in depth diagrams?

Any information would be greatly appreciated,thanks.

Paul

[xvvvz]

Paul -

The MB WIS has much better wiring diagrams. You can buy copies of it off of Ebay very cheap. You just have to pray to the PC gods before you install it and hope that it installs without a hitch. It also requires 5 GB of disk space but you then get to browse info on about every MB car, truck, van, bus, Unimog, etc., built since 1968

The wiring diagram function is not just one graphic, or I would have tried to email it to you. It is an interactive tree/thread thing which will jump you all around many diffferent pages. If you are looking for something simple, I will attempt to look it up for you but if you are needing all of the wires for the ECU I doubt I can find, much less print, that in one diagram. PM me with specifics.

[Pagz]

Cheers!,
I thought that may be the case with the MB diagrams!,as iv had SlammedC send me a few before...though im at the stage now where i need almost the whole lot...and i know that would be a pain for somone to sift though trying to find what im after!...I wasnt aware they could be purchased on ebay(pirated i guess?),ill do a search and check it out!,thanks man.

Wiring the new ecu to the engine should be easy...its all those other wires that go from the ecu into the cabin thats got me alittle worried=)


Paul

[xvvvz]

Just search for "Mercedes WIS" and you will find them. There may be others listed under something like "Mercedes Manual" or "Mercedes Repair Manual." Just make sure it is the genuine WIS data. There are a lot of other crappy electronic manuals out there.

[Pagz]

Hows this one look?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/WIS-M...spagenameZWDVW


Its my first time doing ignition systems,thought i understand a basic coil,ignition module and how it all works...im alittle confused about the MB setup...
do you know if the coils on the M111 have integrated ignition modules on top of the coil?...or did the bosch ecu have the modules integrated into it?...Iv purchased two dual ignition modules(and 4 new coils) as i was going to run four coils,but have changed my mind so will just use one module with the motec ecu and run the OE wasted spark for the time being...however i was trying to test the coils the other day to make sure i got the wiring correct and had difficulty finding which of the two wires on each coil was a common ground,there was also no connection between the two coil outputs on each coil...which got me thinking maybe theres a solid state device in there!?!?...sOo confused.

Paul

[c280nz]

il go halves in how much it is aswell! and then either just make me a copy when you get it, or send it down and il copy it and send the original back up to you
that way it will be even cheaper!

xvvvz you dont have a copy you can send do ya?

[xvvvz]

Sorry, I can't help you with your iginition questions. Way out of my league there

Yes, that looks like a good version of the Genuine WIS. They key feature it has that I wish I had received is the video for installation. $15 is a good price and the installation video is worth that in itself. Also, by purchasing it from that guy you should get a contact to email if you have any installation questions - definitely another thing you want. Email the guy directly as I am sure he has more of these available for sale.

There should be a .pdf available after the install that explains the program and how to navigate it (maybe the video will explain it too). Take the time to read it. Don't get discouraged. Once you get a clue, you can find what you need and the amount of data will amaze you.

Before you install, definitely create a restoration point in Windows and defrag your hard drive. Better yet, if you have Ghost or something that can create a backup image of your drive go ahead and create a backup in case the install goes wrong. Sometimes it is easier to just do a restore than to try to do a manual uninstall of a bad installation.

[Pagz]

Originally posted by c280nz
il go halves in how much it is aswell! and then either just make me a copy when you get it, or send it down and il copy it and send the original back up to you
that way it will be even cheaper!

xvvvz you dont have a copy you can send do ya?

Yeah man no worries,its pretty cheap ill just flick you a copy for free!

[c55m8o]

Originally posted by 23K
[B]Hows this one look?

A hell of a lot cheapers then I paid for mine...!

[Pagz]

Originally posted by xvvvz
Sorry, I can't help you with your iginition questions. Way out of my league there

Yes, that looks like a good version of the Genuine WIS. They key feature it has that I wish I had received is the video for installation. $15 is a good price and the installation video is worth that in itself. Also, by purchasing it from that guy you should get a contact to email if you have any installation questions - definitely another thing you want. Email the guy directly as I am sure he has more of these available for sale.

There should be a .pdf available after the install that explains the program and how to navigate it (maybe the video will explain it too). Take the time to read it. Don't get discouraged. Once you get a clue, you can find what you need and the amount of data will amaze you.

Before you install, definitely create a restoration point in Windows and defrag your hard drive. Better yet, if you have Ghost or something that can create a backup image of your drive go ahead and create a backup in case the install goes wrong. Sometimes it is easier to just do a restore than to try to do a manual uninstall of a bad installation.

Thanks for the heads up Doug!,the program does look alittle tricky form the pics!,hopfully the WIS will shed alittle light on the ignition setup as well!=)

Paul

[Pagz]

Originally posted by c55m8o
A hell of a lot cheapers then I paid for mine...!

Excellent..its mine=)

[Pagz]

Doug,
thanks big time for those drawings thats what i was after!!,though there for a 99 C230,mine is a manual 97 model with quite a few less features!...but i guess it will be wired the same for the features it does have...theres alot of data wires running around which is kinda worrieing at the moment hehe

[SLAMMED_C]

hey Paul,
What exactly do you need.. I read relation between ME and asr/bas, and can between cluster and ME.
anything else in particular, I will have a look at what I can find for your car. 1997 C230 Kompressor Manual right?

[Pagz]

From the cluster drawings it looks like vehicle speed and RPM are sent through the CAN bus system that links everthing down to how your feeling that day on the 99 model....Please let it be analog for the 97 model or its all over.:dead:

[Pagz]

Originally posted by SLAMMED_C
hey Paul,
What exactly do you need.. I read relation between ME and asr/bas, and can between cluster and ME.
anything else in particular, I will have a look at what I can find for your car. 1997 C230 Kompressor Manual right?

Sup Ross,
From the drawings Doug sent it looks like everything is tied together by the CAN system on the 99 model,theres also a heap of things mine doesnt have like auto tranny,emmision controls pumps etc etc etc,whats BAS?
if you could find if the 97 manual ran a CAN from the ECU to the CAN bus interface and a CAN from the Cluster to the interface that will be the decider on weather or not this car will run for the next year or so lol.

[SLAMMED_C]

Originally posted by 23K
Sup Ross,
From the drawings Doug sent it looks like everything is tied together by the CAN system on the 99 model,theres also a heap of things mine doesnt have like auto tranny,emmision controls pumps etc etc etc,whats BAS?
if you could find if the 97 manual ran a CAN from the ECU to the CAN bus interface and a CAN from the Cluster to the interface that will be the decider on weather or not this car will run for the next year or so lol.

I will have a look and see what i can find for ya bro.
BAS is brake assist, but our cars dont have it!! maybe the 2000 C230K might.. since its ESP instead of ASR.
but I will have a look for some diagrams on CAN systems for your 97 manual.
let you know as soon as I can man.

[benzboy]

Hey Paul

I'd be keen for a copy too, I had a crappy workshop manual but lost the 2nd disk, this one looks really handy!

[Pagz]

Originally posted by SLAMMED_C
I will have a look and see what i can find for ya bro.
BAS is brake assist, but our cars dont have it!! maybe the 2000 C230K might.. since its ESP instead of ASR.
but I will have a look for some diagrams on CAN systems for your 97 manual.
let you know as soon as I can man.

That would be great man!,yeh i didnt think i had any brake assist,just ABS etc...but if its a CAN/data system then the cluster must get its speed signal from the ABS system as its the only part that had a sensor capable of doing so.
it may be that the data from the ABS goes straight to the cluster via data link and so will still show vehicle speed which the new ECU,however im 99.9% sure if the system is data from the ECU to the cluster it will be a pain to get the RPM running again!

Anyways let me know how you get on!!

[Pagz]

Originally posted by benzboy
Hey Paul

I'd be keen for a copy too, I had a crappy workshop manual but lost the 2nd disk, this one looks really handy!

Yip np will make two,may take a few weeks as i have to send the guy cash via envelop, which i guess is to avoid huge bank fees etc...hes got a good rating on ebay and its only 27NZD hopfully all will go well!.

[Pagz]

Hey Ross i checked the diagrams against what i have and BINGO....I have the CAN bus between everyman an his dog...

So the only way around this will be to use the OE ECU and trick it into thinking its running the engine while using the Motec...Im pretty sure the Data system needs to know engine temp and RPM etc so the other modules like ASR/ AC/cluster etc know where there at...Im guessing i will loose traction control for sure because the motec will have engine control but hey no biggy huh=)

The hard part may be that both ECU's could need cam sensor/crank sensor input,and i will need two engine temp sensors(fark i made a custom mount into the OE sensor for the motecs new sensor)

might have to pay for professional help lol $$$:dead:

[SLAMMED_C]

Originally posted by 23K
Hey Ross i checked the diagrams against what i have and BINGO....I have the CAN bus between everyman an his dog...

So the only way around this will be to use the OE ECU and trick it into thinking its running the engine while using the Motec...Im pretty sure the Data system needs to know engine temp and RPM etc so the other modules like ASR/ AC/cluster etc know where there at...Im guessing i will loose traction control for sure because the motec will have engine control but hey no biggy huh=)

The hard part may be that both ECU's could need cam sensor/crank sensor input,and i will need two engine temp sensors(fark i made a custom mount into the OE sensor for the motecs new sensor)

might have to pay for professional help lol $$$:dead:

so ya dont need any diagrams then?.. too abd i didnt see this sooner!! I got you some diagrams.. dontknow how much help they will be. do you still want them.. or do you think what you have will help you enough?
thats going to be some serious wiring!! running 2 computers (OE to fool the car to think its running it so no issues with faults and lights on the cluster) good luck to you my friend!!
maybe if you have a computer guru friend he can make up some sort of computer program to fool the car into thinkin the ecu is there!

let me know if you need any diagrams Paul.

[Pagz]

Originally posted by SLAMMED_C
so ya dont need any diagrams then?.. too abd i didnt see this sooner!! I got you some diagrams.. dontknow how much help they will be. do you still want them.. or do you think what you have will help you enough?
thats going to be some serious wiring!! running 2 computers (OE to fool the car to think its running it so no issues with faults and lights on the cluster) good luck to you my friend!!
maybe if you have a computer guru friend he can make up some sort of computer program to fool the car into thinkin the ecu is there!

let me know if you need any diagrams Paul.

Hey,
I was going to PM you first just incase you had time!,but thought maybe i should just get the whole manual so i can check everything in detail!,however the drawings that Doug sent through are very useful,and it looks like it will seal the deal...i started wiring last night but probly wont know what iv missed until i see the left over wires after soldering!...actually if you have one that includes the ignition key and its associated wiring that would be most excellent?!!

Actually running the two ECU's sounds tricky,but its not too bad...the real trick will be running them both off a crank or cam sensors...i may need one of our techs to make me a duplicator circuit that will isolate the two ECUs but provide the same signal some how...

there may be some faults come up but they will have no effect on the performance given the OE item will have no say in the matter=)

iv been in contact with the guy who will be doing the tuning and looks like i will wire everything but the cam and crank sensors as they will need to run the scope on while we turn the engine to make sure we get the wires right!...will let you know how i get on!

Cheers,
Paul

[SLAMMED_C]

Originally posted by 23K
Hey,
I was going to PM you first just incase you had time!,but thought maybe i should just get the whole manual so i can check everything in detail!,however the drawings that Doug sent through are very useful,and it looks like it will seal the deal...i started wiring last night but probly wont know what iv missed until i see the left over wires after soldering!...actually if you have one that includes the ignition key and its associated wiring that would be most excellent?!!

Actually running the two ECU's sounds tricky,but its not too bad...the real trick will be running them both off a crank or cam sensors...i may need one of our techs to make me a duplicator circuit that will isolate the two ECUs but provide the same signal some how...

there may be some faults come up but they will have no effect on the performance given the OE item will have no say in the matter=)

iv been in contact with the guy who will be doing the tuning and looks like i will wire everything but the cam and crank sensors as they will need to run the scope on while we turn the engine to make sure we get the wires right!...will let you know how i get on!

Cheers,
Paul

No worries dude.. I will have to look for the ignition wiring for you though. and I will still send you what I have.. maybe it will be of some sort of use. have to scan it tonight.. hopefully get it to you later on tonight.
that wiring harness sounds like a nightmare!!.. hope it works out for ya. it seems like a huge brickwall is in front of you. but Im sure you will break through it. so close now.. this project has been kinda revolutionary for the W202.. not the first turbo'd 202.. but the most custom turbo set up by far.. so many goodies!! especially that intake manifold!!

let us know how it goes.. cant wait for that thing to fire up! its gonna be a beast!

[Pagz]

haha cheers mang!
those drawings you sent will definately help!,there just a tad more in detail then the ones i have...would you have a drawing of where all the wires go to and from the K40/4 module???...I would like to know if the started motor solinoid is energized from the OE ecu via the K40/4 or energized from the ignition switch itself,just incase the OE ecu has some control over the started motor(which i think it might because some models have a starter assist module)

If you dont have a drawing showing K40/4 and its relation to everything else thats alright....because it may only be in parts with other diagrams on random pages...I can just wait for the CD's that will turn up in 2-4 weeks.

Oh and if you have that ignition diagram lying around that would be sUuuuper=)

[SLAMMED_C]

Originally posted by 23K
haha cheers mang!
those drawings you sent will definately help!,there just a tad more in detail then the ones i have...would you have a drawing of where all the wires go to and from the K40/4 module???...I would like to know if the started motor solinoid is energized from the OE ecu via the K40/4 or energized from the ignition switch itself,just incase the OE ecu has some control over the started motor(which i think it might because some models have a starter assist module)

If you dont have a drawing showing K40/4 and its relation to everything else thats alright....because it may only be in parts with other diagrams on random pages...I can just wait for the CD's that will turn up in 2-4 weeks.

Oh and if you have that ignition diagram lying around that would be sUuuuper=)

Ill have a look for the k40 diagram.. and the ignition ones too.
glad the other diagrams are of use!