Thoughts on disassembling multi-piece wheels..

**SLAMMED_C** · 02-26-2006, 02:59 PM

Well I have run into a lil bit of a dead end here!..
I was trying to take my wheels apart to send them out for powder coating.. but it seems that even after I took all the bolts out that hold the inner to the 2 outers it still wont come apart!
is the inner (wheel center) bonded with some sort of sealant to the 2 inners?
how can I get this to give way and split them apart?
anyone know how the professionals do it?
maybe heat the rim up to softent he sealant?
HELP PLEASE!!!!

**jnenad16** · 02-26-2006, 05:27 PM

why dont you contact the rim manufacturer?

nenad

**c55m8o** · 02-26-2006, 06:34 PM

first try a 3 pound sledgehammer.
next try a 10 pound sledgehammer.

...I keeed! ya, I'd contact the manufacturer. It might come down to needing to give them a good shot tho. It sounds like it'll be nice. I'm doing the same too, but I'm sending mine back the manufacturer since I need them re-drummed too.

**IamJanuar** · 02-26-2006, 08:09 PM

I was helping my friend replace his wheels yesterday. Apparently after we took out the bolts the wheels was still stuck in there! Three big guys were trying to pull it out by hand but still to no avail. We sprayed some WD-40 and let it sit for a while before I gave it a good kick (of course you can only do this to OEM wheels though). It came out at last.

Apparently there is a lot of build up inbetween the metals that is holding them together. There were rust, salt and other hard materials.

If you had used you wheels for some time that could be one of the problems. Try spraying some lubricant and have a bucket of soap and water ready in case you feel uncomfortable applying those chemical to your wheels... I will.

**jnolte** · 02-26-2006, 08:17 PM

these wheels are brand new never mounted correct?

**SLAMMED_C** · 02-27-2006, 06:41 AM

Originally posted by jnolte
these wheels are brand new never mounted correct?

they are relativly new.. they were previously used.. but I dont think for very long.
they look very clean.

**jaysonvaldez** · 02-27-2006, 10:11 AM

I notice sometimes on multi pieces rims there is a welded bead in the inner section that has to be chiseled off I think. I'm not to sure if you have that bead in the inner section. I know many Japanese rims like works and racing harts. You can take the screws off and it easily comes off.

rollinrealbig · 02-27-2006, 07:13 PM

LoL if it gets stuck like that just pop the rims back on and go driving - they will come apart instantly!!!!

LoL no dont do that im just kidding!

**Under Pressure** · 02-27-2006, 07:30 PM

Originally posted by c55m8o
I'm doing the same too, but I'm sending mine back the manufacturer since I need them re-drummed too.

You are not powdercoating your forged aluminum wheels, are you? They can not withstand the heat of the powdercoating process and lose their integrity and strength. You better paint them instead if you want them looking another color. My source was Luke from Tirerack and pics as proof came from a BBS forged aluminum wheel OEM on the STi that some kid had powdercoated then bent pretty badly while tracking. I provided a link to my source on bnzsport, just do a search for it...

**SLAMMED_C** · 03-02-2006, 05:57 PM

okay... well I figured this out a lil bit now!!
there is no sealant or gasket in between the outer and the wheel center. it was just a lil stuck down.. and with a lil brute force and ignorance.. I have got 3 of them apart... I ended up turning the rim on its face with a piece of card board under it and putting on my running shoes.. just jumped on the wheel center a whole bunch of times and she popped out!

I have only got 3 of the rims apart, for some reason the last one wants to be a bitch.. so its uber stuck!.. I will hopefully get it apart at work tomorrow...
then I can finally send them out for powder coat!!.. about frigin time!!

**The LO C** · 03-02-2006, 09:32 PM

Now have fun getting them back in with the holes to line up (and remember that it will be more of a bitch powdercoated).

**SLAMMED_C** · 03-03-2006, 03:42 PM

okay... finally got the last one apart..
just had a buddy at work do the jumping instead of me!! (he weighs a LIL more then me!) popped apart no problem!
hopefully they will go out for p[owder coat the week of March 6...

Im not worried at all about lining them back up again.. they can only go one way so I shouldnt have any balance issues after wards.. and even wehn powder coated.. there is still enough room for them to be slightly thicker.. or I can just sand the powder coat down a lil so they slide back in..
the wheels are marked.. so I know what center came from what set of outers.

**c55m8o** · 03-04-2006, 10:13 AM

Ya dude. Listen to Under Pressure. Get the rims Anodized, not Powder Coated. Kinesis just confirmed as well to me that you'll ruin the integrity/strength of the rims with Powder Coating.

rollinrealbig · 03-04-2006, 09:38 PM

what exactly is powder coating ? im new to it!

I know anodizing but dont know how they do it .

**Under Pressure** · 03-04-2006, 10:39 PM

Originally posted by rollinrealbig
what exactly is powder coating ? im new to it!

I know anodizing but dont know how they do it .

Powdercoating is covering something (wheels in this case) with a certain powder. It is usually kept on the wheel by magnetic charge. Then you take the wheel with the special powder and you bake it until the powder melts on and bonds together. It gives a real tough finish, but requires high temps to melt the powder. It is these high temps that affect the integrity of forged aluminum wheels.

It is usually done for cheaper than painting.

In exchange for this info, could you please tell me what anodizing consists of? I don't know. I can usually tell when something is anodized by looking at it, but I do not know the process.

rollinrealbig · 03-05-2006, 10:22 AM

LoL thanks for clearing that up for me!

I dont know how they anodize things ... im guessing its like spraying it w/no heat or anything involved ???

need any pictures of what it looks like ?

it comes in lots of colors too. LoL

**Renn 208** · 03-05-2006, 12:43 PM

powdercoating is basically dry paint..instead of the wet paint that you know and love, it's paint in powder form which adheres to the surface via an electrostatic charge.

Anodizing is a chemical process where the metal is etched in a bath, then stuck in an acid bath, then stuck in a dye bath (where the colors come from). It makes the surface of the metal harder in the process, and is done at lower temps than powder coating.

You can see the difference pretty easily....powder coated stuff looks like there's a layer of really even paint. While anodized stuff looks like dyed bare metal. If you want to see it in person, just go to a bike shop and ask...

rollinrealbig · 03-05-2006, 01:37 PM

Originally posted by Renn 208
powdercoating is basically dry paint..instead of the wet paint that you know and love, it's paint in powder form which adheres to the surface via an electrostatic charge.

Anodizing is a chemical process where the metal is etched in a bath, then stuck in an acid bath, then stuck in a dye bath (where the colors come from). It makes the surface of the metal harder in the process, and is done at lower temps than powder coating.

You can see the difference pretty easily....powder coated stuff looks like there's a layer of really even paint. While anodized stuff looks like dyed bare metal. If you want to see it in person, just go to a bike shop and ask...

yupers! I have a few billet parts on my goped.

**SLAMMED_C** · 03-05-2006, 01:39 PM

Originally posted by c55m8o
Ya dude. Listen to Under Pressure. Get the rims Anodized, not Powder Coated. Kinesis just confirmed as well to me that you'll ruin the integrity/strength of the rims with Powder Coating.

""The powder coating process uses a solvent free dry mix of plastic resins, pigments and fillers that melt and fuse together when heated. The solid particles of coating are electrostatically charged in a spray gun and carried by low velocity air to the surface of the piece to be coated. The electrostatic charge holds the powder particles in place while the part is cured in a 400-degree oven. The heat of the oven causes a chemical reaction to occur and the powder to cure, creating a highly durable finish.""
www.custompowdercoating.com

even on websites for custom powder coating it says they can do car wheels.. aluminum car wheels.. so I cant see the rim being ruined or weakened at all.
I think the wheel can withstand the curing temps in the oven (400 degrees) without worries.. just any temps higher then that and you may run into problems.. like one site it said that they can do a burning process, which means they put your part into an oven and heat it to 900 degrees.. this helps thermally destory the bonding agents in coatings. makes it easier to media blast the rust or whatever off of a part.. but it specifically says that aluminium parts cannot be put into the burning over as it will lose its strength.. it cannot handle the high temps.
so for my application I wont have anything to worry about.
the only reason I chose to have my wheels powder coated is that it will definetly stand up to the elements better.. a painted finish can easily chip.. and an anodized finish can be easily scratched.. very easily.
the powder coat is so much more durable.. but has the look of a nice paint job to it.

**c55m8o** · 03-07-2006, 05:00 PM

Yup, I stand corrected; both from you and the person @ Kinesis who handles repairs. She stated something different then the 1st person I talked to. She stated getting them powdercoated once and maybe having them repaired once more is ok; but just that (and I have a quote and am now considering it). Further stating the rims can't handle multiple applications of Powdercoating if you redo/repair them more then once. What must be avoided is what you noted of having the current finish stripped off through extremely high heat baking.

**Under Pressure** · 03-08-2006, 08:03 PM

BELOW IS A CUT & PASTE FROM A POWDERCOAT / FORGE ALUM WHEEL DISCUSSION FROM A SUBARU WEBSITE...

Luke@tirerack
Tire Rack Moderator

Member#: 1215
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: The Tire Rack

800 -428-8355
ext. 362

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

we have had many people with forged wheels that are heat treated from SSR, OZ, BBS, etc. powder coat their wheels only to find them extremely soft afterwards ...... many have even had them bend when installing tires on them ...... just watch Jesse James from Monster Garage make a fuel tank for a chopper and you will see how easy it is to anneal metal .....

FOR REFERENCE, SEE LINK BELOW...

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...els+powdercoat

Also, check out this pic of someone who powdercoated the stock forged aluminum wheels off their Subaru WRX STi as well as the link to the thread of discussion...

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...64#post9321464

**c55m8o** · 03-08-2006, 08:19 PM

But how do we know that these wheels weren't rendered softened/annealled due to the old finish being baked off via extreme heat?

**SLAMMED_C** · 03-09-2006, 09:51 AM

When I made my comments about powder coating wheels.. I was refering to regular aluminium wheels.. NOT forged aluminium wheels as I dont know the properties of forged aluminium.
but if forged wheels are already heat treated.. then shouldnt they be stronger and therefor less prone to being bent, also be able to handle higher temps?

I dont know what would happen to a forged aluminium wheel if it was baked in an oven at 400 degrees.. I guess technically it could be weakened..
but as c55m8o pointed out.. who knows if the wheels ahd been through a burning process to break down the old finish.
the safest way for taking off an old finish would be to media blast wouldnt it?

**Under Pressure** · 03-09-2006, 04:17 PM

I'm just providing an argument that powdercoating forge alum wheels is bad, in the end it's your decision. I think you should just spend the extra loot and get them painted. You will have a bigger selection of colors to choose from too. I would go for an anthracite colored paint in the inside, and polish the lip. Mmmmm.

**SLAMMED_C** · 03-10-2006, 09:15 PM

Originally posted by Under Pressure
I'm just providing an argument that powdercoating forge alum wheels is bad, in the end it's your decision. I think you should just spend the extra loot and get them painted. You will have a bigger selection of colors to choose from too. I would go for an anthracite colored paint in the inside, and polish the lip. Mmmmm.

Oh Im not questioning the forged wheel thing.. obviously its an issue if people with forged wheels have them powder coated and they bend!!
its not about the cost for me.. Im choosing not to paint my wheels cause the finish is so easy to damage and chip.. I just want the added protection from the powder coat.. and if a good powder coat job is done it can look just as good as a paint job.
plus the fact my wheel centers arent forged aluminium.. if they were.. I wouldnt be having them powder coated!
and Im sure they would weigh a hell of a lot less if they were forged!!

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