To those of you who have a CAI [Archive]

bish0p

03-12-2007, 01:38 AM

Hello. I've just begun thinking about making a cai too. I have a question though. there seems to be a sensor of some type at the bend after the MAS sensor. How did you put that sensor into the custom piping that you did? i have a c280 i6, the sensor thing is on the right side of the engine. it's small and looks like it might be an O2 sensor or something. Do i have to cut a hole in the piping to fit that in? thanks for the help

jnenad16

03-12-2007, 03:04 AM

that is the intake air temperature sensor.

nenad

bish0p

03-12-2007, 03:26 AM

oo. so i should keep that sensor. any suggestions on how to install it into the intake? i'm going to do a 90 degree silicon angle right there and it connects to an aluminum pipe that runs over the engine. also thinking of wrapping the pipe in fiberglass as an insulator, either that or coat it with ceramic. should i just drill a whole in the pipe and put the sensor there? i'm not quite sure how the sensor goes on it. thanks for the help

bish0p

03-12-2007, 05:31 AM

also what size breather would i use for a 95 c280 i6?

OCKlasse

03-12-2007, 08:49 AM

Originally posted by bish0p
also what size breather would i use for a 95 c280 i6?

I believe you might need two...just go to Pepboys and find an appropriately-sized breather

jnenad16

03-12-2007, 12:49 PM

yes, you'll need to make a hole for that sensor. you'll also need to take care of the breathers appropriately. you can either put on filters on them and leave them exposed or incorporate them into the intake just like the OEM version, but install an oil catch can inline with them. that way, your engine will still have the benefits of the breathers, but wont recycle the oil vapors out of it.

nenad

bish0p

03-12-2007, 03:02 PM

yeah i saw on one of the member's car on the forum and he had 2 breathers. I haven't taken off the intake going over the engine yet so i dont know what i'm dealing with. Is it just 2 holes? or does it have like a pipe coming out? because right now i dont have an idea of how the breather is suppose to stay there.

enawazh

03-12-2007, 07:36 PM

The crossover pipe has two small tubes built into it that slide into the holes when mounted. once you remove the crossover pipe the holes will be exposed.youd have to buy two tubes of the same Diameter, should be enough to mount the breathers. hope i didnt confuse you

bish0p

03-13-2007, 02:36 AM

o. does the tube that i put in there have to be like a perfect fit? is it a big deal if it's not a really tight fit? i see a lot of breathers sold out there that has a tube on it with a clamp so you can connect it to another tube i guess. i believe i also saw some that was made so it is just pushed into a hole about 1 inch in diameter. is that what i'm suppose to use?

enawazh

03-14-2007, 12:13 AM

How tight they have to be depends on how pressurized the valvecover is. My guess would be that since youre putting breathers in there then there wont be any pressure that would blow them off. you just have to make sure that they wont just pop off with the slightest touch.
In that case, they would have to be a nice tight fit and shouldnt have any play. Get a hose thats a bit thicker and shove that in there

There are a few concerns

I noticed that the oil vapors coming from the holes make their way into the throttlebody , im guessing for lubrication. if you do implement an oil catch can then do you feed that back into the intake?

I have not made a CAI but i have been studying and preparing myself for whats to come. most of the stuff here is speculation so if someone knows better then please correct me

bish0p

03-14-2007, 12:25 AM

i also am new to this. but from searching what other members have done on here i think i'm capable of making a decent cai. Right now i'm still waiting on the supplies, but the plan is to have silicon bends, a 90 degree and 2x 45 degree. all of it is going to be 3inch piping. other from the silicon im using aluminum pipes but will have that wrapped with some kind of thermal shielding. right now i believe i'm going to do fiberglass and another layer of this foil insulation thing my dad is going to get me. and then i'm going to try to make a little "box" that would seperate the intake pipe that's going down into the bumper from the hot engine bay. this box is most likely going to be made of fiberglass also and lined with ceramic insulating blanket. O yeah and i guess i need 2 breathers for the valve cover

enawazh

03-14-2007, 12:31 AM

Dude sounds complicated .... anyway goodluck to you and hey please please please post pictures of your parts and the install, it will be very helpful. Alot of the CAI threads here just show the finished project. It will be nice to see some of the steps involved.

Good luck

bish0p

03-14-2007, 12:39 AM

for sure i'll post pictures. it's not too complicated. Not much to the steps. just connect the pipes with the clamps and wrap the pipes in the insulation. the box would be a little difficult with molding and fiberglassing though. If there's any questions about any mods that i've done feel free to ask if you dont understand.

enawazh

03-14-2007, 12:42 AM

Ya i meant the molding part lolz

But ya please post and i will let you know of any questions

thnx

C280/////AMG

03-15-2007, 07:00 AM

When i get my car back from the body shop i'll post a few pictures of my CAI. It literally took half an hour to install (btw i made it myself, still using all the sensors...those sensors are there for a reason!!!) I've certainly noticed an increase in acceleration, however only above 90mph. From feel, i'd say power has increased by about 15hp from this CAI alone (but once again, only from 90mph and up), so it's definately worth it.

bish0p

03-15-2007, 09:16 PM

anyone have any pictures of how they fabricated the intake temperature sensor into the intake? thank you.

NoRemedy

03-18-2007, 04:34 PM

It seems to me that cold air induction systems are getting quite popular. Sorry but I need to comment on this one. First off, replacing the factory intake for a custom cold air setup seems entirely pointless for three reasons. Number one, the system that MB put there is not very restictive hence doesn't need to be upgraded. Number two, the system already has a cold air feed from behind the grill next to the passenger headlight. So, not only is it pointless to put a filter in the bumper but it also sits in the way of the ventilation duct for the front brakes. The third reason is bolt on components are not designed to make hp by themselves, but help the engine and related systems reach full potential. Basically, your intake won't do anything unless you start upgrading everything else (this is where companies like AEM make hp claims). Not to be mean, rude or disrespectful, but claiming that an intake alone adds 15 horsepower is just plain wrong. There have even been many instances where adding one bolt on yields a net loss in hp (dynos never lie). The gains you experience are more than likely the effect of the car just making more noise, hence it "feels" faster. Again, sorry to be the one to point it out, but it needed to be said. Pick up any publication on how to make a car go faster at your local bookstore and you'll find the same stuff. Sorry.

bish0p

03-18-2007, 07:54 PM

i can't speak for others about the cai. but i myself fabricated the intake for a better sound, not so much the hp. If i were to do anything to gain hp i would first start off with the pulley. i have just finished my CAI today and will have pictures up asap. but currently i do not have a bypass and the filter sits too low for my liking so i'm going to have to put one in soon just to be safe.

NoRemedy

03-19-2007, 05:27 AM

Well, if it's sound you want, sound you'll get that's for sure.

OCKlasse

03-19-2007, 09:19 AM

Originally posted by NoRemedy
Well, if it's sound you want, sound you'll get that's for sure.

I can have this debate a million times over...volumetric efficiency - look it up. I have made my cold air one size...from the filter to the throttle body. On our cars, the crossover pipe is narrower than the intake tube itself. Hence, when I would hit the gas, it would take some time for the car to collect the needed extra air...now my throttle response is greatly improved. Just to reiterate this, I had to go back to stock to get my car smogged, and I did notice a difference between the two. I would not have gone back the intake if it didn't do a difference, try it out for yourself...the biggest difference is the crossover pipe :twocents:

NoRemedy

03-19-2007, 10:02 AM

There's no differance. The only differance is noise. You think the car feels faster. I know because I've already tried and found out the hard way. Been there and done that. I don't need to look up anything. If there is any gain, it's minimal. We're talking 1 maybe 2 hp. In order for your intake to do anything, you need to mod the rest of the system. Exhaust, headers, cams, throttle body and retune for more fuel, air and so fourth. Then the intake makes power, with the rest of the stuff you just put on. In other words, THE INTAKE MAKES NO EXTRA POWER BY ITSELF. I see in your sig you have supersprint as one of your mods. An exhaust with your intake could make power. Not an intake by itself. I never said they were pointless all together, just pointless by themselves. Run it on a dyno and see for yourself. Again, not my theory or opinion, but fact. Argue all you want. As soon as I see a dyno chart for before and after, on a STOCK 202, I will then retract any argument. I seriously doubt though that Mercedes is any exception from any other modded vehicle.

OCKlasse

03-19-2007, 01:29 PM

Originally posted by NoRemedy
There's no differance. The only differance is noise. You think the car feels faster. I know because I've already tried and found out the hard way. Been there and done that. I don't need to look up anything. If there is any gain, it's minimal. We're talking 1 maybe 2 hp. In order for your intake to do anything, you need to mod the rest of the system. Exhaust, headers, cams, throttle body and retune for more fuel, air and so fourth. Then the intake makes power, with the rest of the stuff you just put on. In other words, THE INTAKE MAKES NO EXTRA POWER BY ITSELF. I see in your sig you have supersprint as one of your mods. An exhaust with your intake could make when power. Not an intake by itself. I never said they were pointless all together, just pointless by themselves. Run it on a dyno and see for yourself. Again, not my theory or opinion, but fact. Argue all you want. As soon as I see a dyno chart for before and after, on a STOCK 202, I will then retract any argument. I seriously doubt though that Mercedes is any exception from any other modded vehicle.

I did my intake far before my Supersprint, and what I can tell you is throttle response is certainly better (exhaust didn't do crap)...if you look at simple math, there is more air volume coming into the motor than previously, therefore the car is getting air faster, thereby giving quicker throttle response...speculate all you want, but it works. Before I had my ECU reprogrammed, the car was on the dyno, and my car was running LEAN because I was getting TOO MUCH AIR...Dyno therefore proved that I was getting considerably more airflow than before. Case Closed :o

NoRemedy

03-19-2007, 05:12 PM

Yeah, it was running lean......lean is bad.......that's how motors pop............ hence, not making any extra power. Did you make any extra power? Post you're dyno results, I would like to view them for my own curiosity......Improved throttle response is still not extra power. Read my post.....I never said the intake didn't work. Of course you would have more airflow. However in order to make power you need to optimize all aspects of the engine. IMPROVED AIRFLOW IS ABSOLUTELY USELESS UNLESS ALL AREAS ARE ENHANCED. Read the sentence in my previous post thats all in caps. Case Reopened:o

I know it's kind of off topic, but if you really want to make a 202 fast, think about it's weakness.......it's weight. If it's power you want, quit messing with what MB has already perfected and just give in and buy a c36. If something insignicant like an intake really made any differance do you think companies like Renntech and Brabus might of thought about making and selling them? Think about this.....Added unsprung weight like 20" wheels and a trunk full of useless stereo equipment is probably not helping the cause. This IS in fact my opinion. So no comments please.

OCKlasse

03-19-2007, 05:47 PM

Ideally, when one does something like an intake for example, one should also do exhaust and headers for optimum "breathing"; however, it is not detrimental to do one area over another. I drive a C230: I would not constitute that as a performance car, and I do not see the sense in gutting this car out to make it "handle better"...these are luxury cars, and that was their purpose. I have said in the past I have "felt a difference" from the intake - now if you want to feel a difference, go ahead and do the intake. If you need to see some numbers on a sheet for your own utility then that's you, but not me...This is the last time I will post on this, but I will tell anyone who wants to do this that you do feel a difference, period.

jnolte

03-19-2007, 06:27 PM

how luxury does it become when its slammed on 19s?

xvvvz

03-19-2007, 06:36 PM

>>On our cars, the crossover pipe is narrower than the intake tube itself. <<

I have always wondered why MB did that with the normally aspirated 230 and 220.

OCKlasse

03-19-2007, 10:06 PM

Originally posted by jnolte
how luxury does it become when its slammed on 19s?

...aren't VIP cars still luxury cars?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v176/carb0/gs135.jpg
http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e10/purehawaii/IMG_0098-1.jpg

OCKlasse

03-19-2007, 10:08 PM

Originally posted by xvvvz
>>On our cars, the crossover pipe is narrower than the intake tube itself. <<

I have always wondered why MB did that with the normally aspirated 230 and 220.

werd.

NoRemedy

03-20-2007, 07:41 PM

OCklasse, agreed. You're right, these are luxury cars. If I wanted to gut something just to go fast it probably wouldn't be a benz. Very valid point taken. But, just as you'll stick to your guns, I'll stick to mine. Your conclusion came from your own research and experience just as my conclusion came from my own. That's what modding cars is all about. Individualality. No more debating. Later.

OCKlasse

03-20-2007, 09:22 PM

Originally posted by NoRemedy
OCklasse, agreed. You're right, these are luxury cars. If I wanted to gut something just to go fast it probably wouldn't be a benz. Very valid point taken. But, just as you'll stick to your guns, I'll stick to mine. Your conclusion came from your own research and experience just as my conclusion came from my own. That's what modding cars is all about. Individualality. No more debating. Later.

werd. :bunny:

jnolte

03-20-2007, 09:41 PM

Originally posted by OCKlasse
...aren't VIP cars still luxury cars?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v176/carb0/gs135.jpg
http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e10/purehawaii/IMG_0098-1.jpg

each to there own, many would consider a VIP style car "ghetto" and unclassy.

I happen to like VIP cars myself.

I dont really consider a car with a back breaking suspention and teeth chattering wheel combo to be luxurious any more, even though the car was originally a "luxury" car. I dont think mercedes intended us to slam them and put oversized wheels on them either. Just as a c230 with a
big ol turbo and straight pipes,problay wasent intended, but could be damn fast performance race car.

So if someone wants to gut and turbo their "race car" they can do that, and if someone wants to "slam" and kit their "luxury vip" car they can do that.

I just think its all a waste of money and people should invest in an frickin IRA hahaa

OCKlasse

03-20-2007, 10:44 PM

...if I just saved up all my money, alas...

but about the back-breaking suspension, they all run coilover/universal air suspensions (aka riding on air) and my accumulators are going to make my car smoother than stock...

jnolte

03-20-2007, 11:59 PM

Originally posted by OCKlasse
...if I just saved up all my money, alas...

but about the back-breaking suspension, they all run coilover/universal air suspensions (aka riding on air) and my accumulators are going to make my car smoother than stock...

nah man, i bet a majority of them (besides the obvious) chop the springs, ala indo style

C280/////AMG

03-21-2007, 07:03 AM

OC, I agree with you all the way. I've noticed sharper throttle response, as well as more power, but only from above 90mph, cos then it's almost acting as a forced induction system.

I've also noticed that fuel consumption is considerably lower...8.5l/100km if i really try. This was never achievable before.

At the end of the day, you can't say a sedan should be like this, and a sports car should be like that. it all comes down to personal tastes. If you wanna do it, DO IT. It's your car, not society's.

bish0p

03-27-2007, 01:23 PM

here are a few pictures. i was too lazy to upload all of them.

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u202/mrbish0p/Photo-0044.jpg

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u202/mrbish0p/Photo-0047.jpg

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u202/mrbish0p/Photo-0045.jpg
and that's the insulation i used, it's like a foil on top, laced with fiberglass and silicon(the red part)

edit:// recently i've added a bypass valve because the thing is so low. so the long pipe that goes down to the bumper actually has a foam bypass right there. sounds a lot meaner and a little better response.

Benzon

03-27-2007, 07:11 PM

Look's nice man, I just hate the big hole that is created when removing the stock air box. Need's somethin' over there for it to look balanced for me. But that defflooks mean ;).

Green Lantern

03-29-2007, 11:15 AM

Originally posted by OCKlasse
...aren't VIP cars still luxury cars?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v176/carb0/gs135.jpg
http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e10/purehawaii/IMG_0098-1.jpg

off topic but what are the rims on that infiniti(2nd one)? and nice setup there bishop, is that insulation expensive?

bish0p

03-30-2007, 09:06 AM

i got the insulation from my dad so it was free for me. but he said it's very expensive. i have two layers wrapped on there right now and he said it was suppose to run about 2-300 dollars.

blackc230

03-30-2007, 10:00 AM

Originally posted by bish0p
here are a few pictures. i was too lazy to upload all of them.

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u202/mrbish0p/Photo-0044.jpg

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u202/mrbish0p/Photo-0047.jpg

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u202/mrbish0p/Photo-0045.jpg
and that's the insulation i used, it's like a foil on top, laced with fiberglass and silicon(the red part)

edit:// recently i've added a bypass valve because the thing is so low. so the long pipe that goes down to the bumper actually has a foam bypass right there. sounds a lot meaner and a little better response.

I like your setup. This is what I've been looking for.
some questions tho..is that 6 cylinder you got there? this question may sound stupid to some of you..please forgive me coz I'm pretty much new in W202 world.

hows the clearance between the pipe and your bonnet? I think there's a slight difference between your engine cover and mine. I drive a C230. In mine, the back end of the cover is not indented like yours.

is it possible to use this setup on a C230?

thanks mate