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C280Sportster
09-20-2003, 09:53 AM
I was thinking of "maybe" getting a SC for my engine, but if the costs run about $12,000 I think I'm better off getting a C43...Selling my car and buying a 1998/1999 C43 would cost less than Super Charging my car and the C43 will probably be faster and can still have a warranty. But, I could try and do some "cheap" mods to my engine and if I can get 30-40 HP I think I would be happy...

Our 280 blocks are the same as 320, can we bore the 280 to 320 and then we use 320 internals ?

Anyway to raise the compression ? Maybe 10.5 psi would net maybe10 hp ?

Evo’s UD pulleys would help 0-60 times (10 HP in first gear, etc).

I believe EVO's got some headers now, 10 HP ?

Speedy did some cool mods, the intake gasket he made would help…plus port and polish.

Improved the intake and add free flow cat and new exhaust, 6 hp total, maybe ?

$400 upsolute chip, if that gets 10 HP, then that’s worth it.

Electric fan ?



Anything else guys ?


Of course if I bought a C43 I might be trying to get more power from that engine as well.

speedybenz
09-20-2003, 10:36 PM
I would use a Unichip programable ECU instead of Upsolute chip.

You could add an Electric Water pump to the mix, 8-10Hp.

Have you done the cold air mod routeing the air from the front bumper to the stock airbox.

Use some Mobil 1 0-20 oil good for 3-5 Hp.

Use Oil Extreme good for 6-8 Hp.

2.5"-3" catback exhaust using Magnaflow straight through muffler, remove resonator.

C280Sportster
09-21-2003, 07:24 AM
Originally posted by speedybenz
I would use a Unichip programable ECU instead of Upsolute chip.

You could add an Electric Water pump to the mix, 8-10Hp.

Have you done the cold air mod routeing the air from the front bumper to the stock airbox.

Use some Mobil 1 0-20 oil good for 3-5 Hp.

Use Oil Extreme good for 6-8 Hp.

2.5"-3" catback exhaust using Magnaflow straight through muffler, remove resonator.

Wow, I'll take those gains !

Where can we order the electric water pump ?

tell me more about this: "2.5"-3" catback exhaust using Magnaflow straight through muffler, remove resonator." 6-8 HP gains ? maybe ?


Also, speedy, can you still get that heat spacer for the intake manifold made (that you did for you C280) ? Maybe we 280ers can do a group buy.

What up with EVO's UD pullys and their new V6 headers ?

Anyone have either ?

speedybenz
09-21-2003, 09:17 AM
I will dig up the company name that will make the spacers for $100 a set. I just don't have the time to make another set right now.

The headers might be a good addition but it is the stock cats that are killing the exhaust flow.

You can get one of these kits to measure back pressure. I did and found out some good info. Here is the link:

http://www.jdsdiagnostic.com/eptspage.htm

Kleeman also made an Aluminum crank pulley that is 6 pound lighter than the stock unit and helped the V6 accelerate better.

Jeff

C280Sportster
09-22-2003, 03:29 PM
What have you done or plan to do to the C43 ?

Those 280 mods you did to your old car, seem like they would help the C43 also.

Scotty-C190E
09-22-2003, 04:08 PM
Modifying your MB engine is not worth it unless you are looking to spend a stupid amount of money for what you get. If that's your bag, great, but don't expect your engine to last. If you want affordable power from MB, buy AMG, preferably C36 or 500E.

speedybenz
09-22-2003, 08:07 PM
I have done all of the things I did to my C280 to my C43 engine. And they have all helped performance.

I would certanly look at a Magnaflow muffler and getting rid of the resonator. From the two rear cats I would run 3" exhaust tubing to the back into a nice straight through Magnaflow.

The phenolic spacers were a big help and I bought a used c43 MAS that bolted up and helped to.

Also cutting a 3" hole in my airbox and then running a 3" tube from the passenger side fog light location to the airbox made a big difference. But you need to fab a nice duct to fit the bumper nicely and then everything from there to the airbox must be air tight. You want that high pressure air to ram into the airbox and any leaks in the tubing or connections will reduce the Hp output.

Put in some Redline Shockproof Lightweight gear oil in the diff.

Mobil 1 ATF in the tranny.

Replacing the rear diff with a 3.41 or 3.67:1 gear ratio would really help with acceleration.

willpower
09-23-2003, 01:45 AM
I've got the same 2.8L V6... looking for some performance stuff too

Just wondering though, 3" piping and a straight-through muffler sounds like a lot of flow... I always thought that some backpressure was good for naturally-aspirated engines... or did I get that mixed up with turbocharged engines? :confused:

And if the stock cats are the weakest link in the exhaust system, would high-flow cats help with this situation?

Thanks!

speedybenz
09-23-2003, 08:38 AM
I just want to address the exhaust myth's.

Exhaust theory is based on the exhaust flow, mass and speed. All of these things help to create exhaust waves which run through the exhaust pipes like a "Slinky". The exhaust waves travel back and forth at the speed of sound.

It is this action which if timed right can cause a negative pressure wave in the exhaust pipe when the valve is open at valve overlap and draw in extra mixture.

Keep in mind that "ONLY THE FIRST 3-5 FEET" of the exhaust system are helping to time these wave pulses and some minor backpressure or flow reduction may be beneficial to HP output for some engines. Not for all engines.

The exhaust piping after that first 3-5 feet only hurts you. The only way to stop that part of the exhaust from causing a negative effect is to have zero backpressure in that part of the system.

So anything you can do to make the exhaust flow with zero backpressure will help HP.

Our systems have so much backpressure from the two front and rear cats that it is these items which will ultimately be the limiting factor on how well your exhaust system works.

So high flow cats would be a big benefit.

CKlasse
09-23-2003, 09:18 AM
Originally posted by C280Sportster
tell me more about this: "2.5"-3" catback exhaust using Magnaflow straight through muffler, remove resonator." 6-8 HP gains ? maybe ?

2.5" should be suffient for a V6/I6. I have few C36 and C280 owner interested in this system. Nokia mentioned something about CLUB202er CAT BACK SYSTEM with Fabulous Tips. If there is a strong interest in this. I am willing to build them at minimal profit and have CLUB202 sells it as an in house product.

Performance wise, you will gain some. My C220 with cold intake and custom downpipe, high flow cats, and straight through magnaflow mufflers gained me merely 3hp and unfornately had some trq lost at 1500-2300 RPM. I replaced the cold intake with a smaller piping. Sure enough, I gained 3-7hp through out the band. It'll only get better on bigger engine!

Nokia, I mustve missed your email since I kind of lost touch with you. I have been busy with a project through S2Ki.com -- S2000 cat back and turbo back systems . Email me about C202 project, man! :)

Jeff, where would you install the electric water pump?

Thanks
;)

speedybenz
09-24-2003, 08:34 PM
CKlasse asked;

Jeff, where would you install the electric water pump?

Well there is the rub. It is hard to figure out wher to mount the damn thing. I have a pretty good idea but now need to find the right plumbing hardware to do it. I need some nice 180degree and 90 degree fittings for the hoses.

But I do want to get it done, I have seen plenty of dyno graphs where 10Hp is gained.

Jeff

C280Sportster
10-02-2003, 11:32 AM
Originally posted by speedybenz
I just want to address the exhaust myth's.
....
So anything you can do to make the exhaust flow with zero backpressure will help HP.
....
So high flow cats would be a big benefit.


Speedy, did you ever dyno your 280 (after all the mods) ?

speedybenz
10-02-2003, 11:48 AM
No I never did Dyno the engine after the mods. I was going to but the car met it's demise.

It would run G-tech 0-60 times of 7.24 sec if I recall correctely.

Jeff

C280Sportster
10-03-2003, 07:08 AM
Originally posted by speedybenz
No I never did Dyno the engine after the mods. I was going to but the car met it's demise.

It would run G-tech 0-60 times of 7.24 sec if I recall correctely.

Jeff

Speedy what do you think about this, the compression is 10:1 for my 280 motor (I think it's the same for yours) what if we changed our head gaskets to a smaller gasket thus increasing the compression (to let's say 10.5:1 like in the new MBs)...since most of us already run 93 octane, I think we would have ourselves about 10 hp.

And there should be no drop in MGP because we are only better using the gas already in our engines.

I know there are also other ways to increase the compression in an engine, (pistons ?) I'd be open to those as well...What do you think ?

speedybenz
10-03-2003, 08:42 AM
Now if you are going to pull the head you what to measure the piston to head clearance, also known as deck ht.

You want to have a deck ht of no more than 0.035". If your motor has a deck ht of say 0.050" then closing it down to 0.035" will give you much more than 10Hp and it will give it to you through the whole powerband.

But I think we could go 11:1 compression if things are smooth in the combustion camber and the deck ht is closed down.

Since you are pulling the head you have a very nice 3-angle valve job done. And maybe new valves and springs. Valve springs really help a motor run sharp. There is a whole bunch of other stuff too

Jeff

C280Sportster
10-13-2003, 01:15 PM
Speedy, you've told me before, but i lost the info.

What did your stock C280 dyno at again ?


I'll save the info this time :)




Thanks

C280Sportster
10-21-2003, 07:18 AM
Originally posted by C280Sportster
Speedy, you've told me before, but i lost the info.

What did your stock C280 dyno at again ?


I'll save the info this time :)




Thanks

Bump,

bum, bum, bum, bump

speedybenz
10-21-2003, 08:46 AM
C280sportster,

My C280 - V6 dyno'd at 160Hp to the rear wheels with Mobil 1 5-30wt oil. We then put the K&N filter on and it made 2Hp more and when we put the Oil Extreme in the engine the Hp came up to 170 Hp.

Also the dyno was a Dynapak model which bolts up right to the hubs, so I do not know if the reading from this type of dyno is the same as a Dynojet model. I just found out that the Dynapak dyno's read almost 10% lower than a typical Dynojet dyno, so the 170Hp should be approx. 187Hp for comparision purposes.

This reading was without the Cold Air system or the phenloic spacers, Remus exhaust, new spark plugs and wires or the C43 MAS sensor with is 5-6mm larger in diameter. And it did not include the porting to the intake manifold.

I do know that with the above mod's the 0-60mph time came down about 0.5 sec to 7.22 sec.

I was going to redyno the car and then it decided it did not like it's owner, it seemed to prefer a tree better.

The biggest bang for the buck was the cold air system using the stock airbox.

Jeff

willpower
10-21-2003, 06:34 PM
stock airbox with drop-in K&N filter? Where did you route the inflow pipe from? Grille or lower airdam? TIA!

speedybenz
10-21-2003, 07:52 PM
I made a duct to fit in the passenger side fog light location. The duct filled the entire opening and then I connected a 3" diameter tube to this and routed it up through the triangle shaped opening in the frame to the stock airbox.

I cut a hole in the airbox to allow the tubing to fit. Make sure everything is airtight from the duct at the bumper to the airbox.

And yes I used a K&N filter.

This mod really woke up the car and gave a real seat-of-the-pants improvment.

Jeff

Ashkan's C280
12-29-2004, 08:42 PM
bump bump bump, so speedy, what were all the mods you did to your c280, and the mods to c43 that were not done to 280? thanks in advance for the reply, good to know 280's can have the hell modded out of them...