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Dearlove
08-22-2013, 09:22 AM
From another topic that was, well, off topic. How ever I'd liked the discussion


If your in the US, mobil 1 is junk.

If your Mobil 1 is made in Germany then you're good.

The Mobil we in the states get is not full synthetic as advertised. It's diluted. Garbage.

I run Pentosyn real full synthetic, Made in Germany. Not sold in stores.


I have seen these arguement before on the internet. You are getting your info from a bunch of internet hype not knowing why the oil used is not good. The problem you have is you state dyou are using 0w40 which is a mild range viscosity that is used for cold engine wear and low friction milage. You take that on a race track and the elevated heat levels thin it out- THUS the encapsulated sludge particals suspended in oil (tht's the basic importance of oils to grab and suspend foreign particles inside your engine) will start to contact again when the oil gets hotter than the intended use range. You need to run a 15w50 and Mobil1 works great. What you also need to do is use an engine treatment for the cold engine startups, not an oil treatment, and engine treatment. one that impregnates into metal surfaces---IE Prolong, slick50, etc.

Mobil1 has been around for decades and has been the industry leader. The product levels they make and sell are best in each group when it comes to price and quality. Are there better things out there? yes, but at what cost AND at what need? You are not running a 24hour LeMans. THose oils made for that type of racing would be terrrible for logevity and continual cold start engines. Alot of those "super racing formulas" are preheated and put into the engine before the engine is fired. The Mobil1 15w50 with an engine treatment assistance will give you a 500k mile engine that can be abused. It is what I used every day int he life of "vetruck" along with Polytron. I pulled that motor out at 640,000 miles and repplaced it just because I had the money and timing was right- I was just getting worried the rings "'had to be going soon"- when I pulled the motor apart out of curiousity before I turned it in for a core refund, I was amazed on how great it looked inside. I abused the hell out of that motor in a 5000 lb truck with pauload after payload, tons of racetrack fun days messing around in it, and many high speed Vegas runs, Palms Springs, Mexico, and Santa Babara+ area blasts in those 20 years I guarantee setting trip records. I do not go anywhere slow when I get open road.

I do currently have Royal Purple in the motor of the truck only because a sponsor gave me it for free, but that's coming out soon and being replaced again by Mobil1 15w50. I don't change only on a milage interval, I replace it when it starts to get dirty looking whether that is 1K miles or 9K miles.

edit to add- Here is Polytron. This is in fact the best lubrication in the world. It is better tha Prolong, slick50, all of them. I personally have done lab type load bearing test with every one of them and have first hand seen the results of my own personal testing. As stated, my very good family friend Michael is the gentleman that first brought this stuff to the US from Russia a few decades ago. I dam near broke his machine trying to put enough load on the bearing to get some wear indications. I have been using this stuf for 20 years as an additive. it is used once in each motor.
https://www.polytrondirect.com/


I just called a buddy on this that is a motor building expert (someone with a very famous father)...

Bill just told me that these oils are now made by a process called Hydrocracking and are dirived from a group 4 base oil. Full synthetics are lab developed and are catagorized as group5 base. His told me even though the process is different, in the end they are very much them same in function. The only ones still using lab techniques are Royal Purple and Amsoil- and both are very costly but do noting better so "don't waste your money kid"(his quote to me.

I learned what I poseted in my first response from him several years ago about using a motor oile that will not thin down with heat too much as to not be able to protect surfaces from the debris it is suspending. Synthetic oils flow better, so you can use thicker synthetics than you can with conventional oils.




Ill take this discussion a little further and also teach you guys that you should NEVER put a synthetic oil into a brand new engine. You will not properly seat the rings. You should always use a high zinc level oil that protects and lubricates at a higher level that conventional oils because of the high levels of zinc and phosporus, but will still allow for enough good wear at temp to seat the engine componants- mainly the rings and cylinder walls for a good seal. Then you drain it after a 1000 miles (I replace it again for another 2000 as I start occationally ramping up the engine rpm use) then I replace it with synthetic. I have done this with two motors and they have lastest an eternity. Every other engine I bought (used cars) I have had not such good luck with internal parts such as timing chains, etc because the first part of their life they wear not pampered with good products and break in procedures.

Here's an example of a high zinc break-in oil ... again, never use a synthetic on a new motor.

http://www.streetsideauto.com/p/lucas-oil-products-10635/?utm_source=googlepepla&utm_medium=adword&utm_content=pla&gclid=CNL03d29kbkCFchxQgodKyQATQ

RemoLexi
08-22-2013, 10:23 AM
From what I've been told by multiple people (all techs) is that the Mobil 1 you buy in cans from Kragen, Autozone ect is not the same that comes in bulk to dealerships from across the pond.

I've always had all white aluminium engine internals with Pentosyn and I will still continue using it, cost is not much more then Mobil, and it's foolish to even consider cost of oil in any comparison- basically what I'm saying is, oil is cheap. Bottom line, oil is much cheaper then an engine. With good oil you can run up to 10k miles no problem.

And the last paragraph about non synthetic oil for new engines, yes I've heard that as well! There's oil for braking-in new engines or rebuilt and the use instructions are just as you stated.

SnowwhiteMerc
08-22-2013, 02:03 PM
[QUOTE=RemoLexi;183426]From what I've been told by multiple people (all techs) is that the Mobil 1 you buy in cans from Kragen, Autozone ect is not the same that comes in bulk to dealerships from across the pond.

I've always had all white aluminium engine internals with Pentosyn and I will still continue using it, cost is not much more then Mobil, and it's foolish to even consider cost of oil in any comparison- basically what I'm saying is, oil is cheap. Bottom line, oil is much cheaper then an engine. With good oil you can run up to 10k miles with no problem

is that oil good for cold conditions as well? what viscosity do you run in the winter???? im sure how cold it gets in norcal lol

RemoLexi
08-22-2013, 02:24 PM
I cannot say what viscosity to run in cold winters, that I would ask your local dealership or someone who is in similar climate.

NorCal or any part of CA 5w40 is fine. We don't have cold winters anywhere near as cold as the east coast does. And where I am- I consider myself lucky to see snow flakes once a year and watch them melt before hitting the ground. Our winters ain't shit. Lol

Vetruck
08-22-2013, 06:38 PM
^^^ yep, and I have to drive up 5000 feet in the dead of winter to find snow, and sometimes higher than that on the warmer years where the local ski resorts reliy mainly on artificial snow blowing. It was mid 90's here today in So Cal near the beach cities, and over 100 when you go inland 50 miles. (Im about 5 miles from the ocean where it stays usually in the 80's).

Oil viscosity has everything to do with startup AND operating temp. You want your oil hot and your water cool, but you do not want the oil hot and thin where it looses oil pressure. If it is thinning so much then it is not encapsulating the foreign debris it is suspending from the engine surfaces as it lubricates.

Oil does 3 things 1) lubricates, 2) cleans the motor internals by encapsulating dirty particules of metal, carbon, etc, and repeals moisture off of corrosin surfaces by keeping them with a petroleum bath. On #3, motors will produce moisture buildup strickly off of combustion. frequent short trips in a car are the worst tyoe of driving habits because if the oil does not get hot enough long enough for the moisture content in the crankcase to boil off, then you will have a build up and internal corrosion will reduce oil life since it will be encapsulating corrison particals of friction surfaces every time the motor heat cycles.

That is the main reason for matching a viscosity to a climate. Most cars do not live in sunny So Cal, nor do they ever see a race track with racing temps of engine strain. if you are in cold climates, but also run your car extremely hard, then you should really either do what i do and run a motor surface treatment to protect it at startup while having adequate viscosity for racing temps, or you should simply change the oil to a thincker one if you are going to a "track day" then change it back for the normal daily use in cold climate.

This Polytron I run supposedly boast the ability to seriously dump a quart of water into the crankcase and not harm the motor- it would supposedly protect the engine friction surfaces with an impregnated layer (alot like a teflon coating) even when the motor is cold and not turning/spinning so as to protect the exposed surfaces to any water corrosion contact and resist wear on no lubricated cold startups- but Ill be damned if I would ever be so foolish to try it just for kicks.

Dearlove
08-22-2013, 10:07 PM
This Polytron I run supposedly boast the ability to seriously dump a quart of water into the crankcase and not harm the motor - but Ill be damned if I would ever be so foolish to try it just for kicks.

Do it




When we ran in new engines (aircraft piston engine) the oil we used was some shit that didn't carry carbon, also we never let the engine drop below ~25% rpm for the first few hours. Im sure there was more to the oil than that but i cared not for piston engine aircraft and now work solely on jet engines, which run full synthetics (pistons use mineral)

SnowwhiteMerc
08-23-2013, 07:35 AM
[QUOTE=RemoLexi;183430]I cannot say what viscosity to run in cold winters, that I would ask your local dealership or someone who is in similar climate.

NorCal or any part of CA 5w40 is fine. We don't have cold winters anywhere near as cold as the east coast does. And where I am- I consider myself lucky to see snow flakes once a year and watch them melt before hitting the ground. Our winters ain't shit. Lol[/QUOTE

LOL thanks bro, i wish i could say the same, i see at least 3 snow storms a year lol

Dearlove
08-23-2013, 08:54 AM
haha, until last year i'd never seen snow...

Vetruck
08-23-2013, 07:37 PM
haha, until last year i'd never seen snow...

You don't get out and party much

...lol.I was a 70's child

Vetruck
08-23-2013, 07:42 PM
Here's me a just a few seasons ago in good ol sunny Calif mountains on artificial snow pack at Mt High Ski Resort. Notice how clean the tree branches are and how sunny the sky is. Stuff gets icy though, alot of ski chatter doing about 60 mph there coming to a stop
http://youtu.be/gUk13qa6OP4

We do occationally get severve stormy years where we can get quite a substantial natural snow pack- sometimes in upwards of 10 feet, but has been more rare the last decade.

On the subject of oil, when I have a car sit in conditions like this all day in freezing or near freezing conditions, I will pull the coil wire and crank the car 3 times for about 15 seconds each to prime the motor with oil, then put the coil wire back on before firing the motor. I also do this to cars when I do an oil change. I will crank the engine several times without spark to ge tthe oilpump full and pumping through the motor before it actually fires the cylinders- Basic prelubing before startup.