Eibach and Stock ride height Bilstein HD's

[davis449]

I was looking into lowering my car and was wondering if it's ok to use Eibach Prokit with Bilstein HD shocks. The site clearly states that the Prokit springs are made to be used with OEM shocks (which is the same ride height, the stock ride height, as my recently installed Bilstein HD's). I wanted to get y'all's take on this one since I hear EVERYONE say you can't lower if you don't have "sport" shocks.

[e harmon]

Originally posted by davis449
I was looking into lowering my car and was wondering if it's ok to use Eibach Prokit with Bilstein HD shocks. The site clearly states that the Prokit springs are made to be used with OEM shocks (which is the same ride height, the stock ride height, as my recently installed Bilstein HD's). I wanted to get y'all's take on this one since I hear EVERYONE say you can't lower if you don't have "sport" shocks.

You'll probably get varying opinions on this. That said, here is mine.

Spring length is a far greater factor in ride height than shocks. The relationship between ride height and shocks is as follows: most shocks are designed to offer optimal damping (prevention of excessive bouncing) within a certain range of extension, which is a product of ride height.

Bilstein HDs, to the best of my knowledge, offer their best damping characteristics at what is generally considered "stock" ride height. You can use lowering springs with them, but shorter lowering springs will tend to operate the shocks in a more compresssed state, where they theoretically will not provide what the designers consider to be their best damping characteristics. Then again, you might prefer the damping characteristics in the more compressed state, which will likely be firmer than the designers intended. They will, however, be "working harder," and possibly wear out more quickly than if they were operating in their intended range.

As an aside, Bilstein Sport Shocks offer identical daming characteristics of the HDs, but have a shorter shaft length in order to stay in the optimal extension range when used with lowering springs.

In short, you can do it, but under certain driving conditions you would technically be running the shocks a bit out of spec. You might be happy with the results in terms of feel, but might shorten the life of the shocks.

Regards,

e harmon

[1995c280]

i think he pretty much summed it up there. you can run the stock HD shocks but they will wear out much faster!

Jason

[davis449]

Yeah I considered that. I think I would much prefer to go the spring route, but considering I just bought these damn shocks, I don't really want to blow them out quickly. How quickly do you think they would wear out?

On the other hand, I do believe my car sits on the thickest pads (4's I think) that they put on this car, so I might just be better off going #1's all the way around. Do y'all think this is the better option?

[1995c280]

that would work out. going from a #4 to #1 will be a subtle drop. maybe not anything major but will look alot better. i find it hard to believe though that you would have a #4 pads in the rear also. they were usually #2 or #3 in most cars. #4 and #5 were the most common up front. but if you really want the drop to be slammed just sell the shocks here or on ebay (they are still new) and then buy some springs and sport shocks!

Jason

[davis449]

I'm not going for slammed. I just want to eliminate some fender gap. If I was going for slammed I would DEFINITELY sell the shocks I have and get new ones. I'm pretty sure you're right about the rear. They're probably #2's but the fronts have to #4's cause it sits high.

[davis449]

I went ahead and did the suspension, but right after I got it back when it was done, it died. I think the fuel pump went. I will post pics soon over in the picture gallery. It looks like zzDragonzz's car now. I really liked what little of the handling I got to feel. The look is great IMO.

[davis449]

UPDATE:

It's official: after approximately 4 months and about 10K miles the Bilstein HD shocks are DEAD. I've had a progressively worse ride and response from the suspension over the last two months.

I was on a cruise to the bar after a monthly car club meet when I hit a bump (an overpass joint to the road) and the ass end flew way up in the air and threw the whole weight distribution of the car from the front to the back like a wave. It sent the front end diving to the ground (no contact though). I had one of my other knowledgeable friends take a ride with me yesterday for a second opinion and he confirmed it. One interesting observation on his part (found by pushing HARD on all four fenders) was that one side of the car is definitely softer than the other.

He is pretty hooked up in the aftermarket parts world so he's calling Bilstein on my behalf Monday morning to get things straightened out. Especially considering that they and Eibach BOTH told me I shouldn't have any problems with this setup, I should be able to get a hefty discount on replacement Bilstein Sports. I'll let you all know how this turns out. Either way, they are getting replaced ASAP.

[NEA-4311]

Originally posted by 1995c280
that would work out. going from a #4 to #1 will be a subtle drop. maybe not anything major but will look alot better. i find it hard to believe though that you would have a #4 pads in the rear also. they were usually #2 or #3 in most cars. #4 and #5 were the most common up front. but if you really want the drop to be slammed just sell the shocks here or on ebay (they are still new) and then buy some springs and sport shocks!

Jason

How can you tell which pads your car is wearing? Can you tell without removing the spring or shock? Im interested in the front mostly. Thanks.

[Proven Guilty]

Originally posted by NEA-4311
How can you tell which pads your car is wearing? Can you tell without removing the spring or shock? Im interested in the front mostly. Thanks.

check out DLS's post at the bottom of this thread:
http://club202.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1426&highlight=spring+pad+bumps

[NEA-4311]

Thanks anyway dude but I was aware of that thread, my question was more on how deep do I need to go in order to see these bumps? Just by removing the wheel or do I need to remove the shock/spring as well?

[Proven Guilty]

you should be able to feel them without even pulling the tire off. just follow the spring up, as the spring is married with the pad itself. i'll try and post a pic tonight if you don't have a chance to explore further :p haha

[NEA-4311]

Originally posted by Proven Guilty
you should be able to feel them without even pulling the tire off. just follow the spring up, as the spring is married with the pad itself. i'll try and post a pic tonight if you don't have a chance to explore further :p haha

Hey nvm, yesterday I went to a repairshop and it happened to have a CLK lifted for an oil change so I saw the whole thing. And for those who are interested it was the previous elegance model wearing stock 16" rims and suspension setup and it had #4 in the front and #2 in the back. CheersszzzZ.

[davis449]

I just got the e-mail today from the Bilstein supplier and the shocks are on their way. The good noew for me is that I am going to get a huge break on them. They are taking back my old ones and gave the Bilstein Sports to me for $239 shipped. Not too bad. I will hopefully get them installed on Thurs. of next week and I will let you all know of the results.

[davis449]

Well the new shocks were put on Thurs. I've noticed a marked improvement in both handling and ride quality from when the springs were first put on with the HD's (while they were still in new condition). The Eibach Proklit springs have a reputation for being bouncy. I was more than willing to confirm this when they were first installed, but I now know that it was the shocks that caused the majority of this bounce at first. Those shocks were definitely not made to vibe with the springs and you could tell that they just didn't have the right valving to absorb shock properly with the Prokits. With the Sports the ride is much smoother cause the car doesn't bounce its way over the dips in the road/freeway like it used to. It has firmed up considerably without being stiff (it doesn't drive like a brick). However, I can say that I now see what some of you have said about the Prokits. They do bounce a little, but not enough to piss me off. It's not a Mini Cooper in the handling department, it never will be, and I never expected it to be. But for a 3400 lb. sedan, it handles well. Overall I'm VERY happy with the result.