C36 Manual conversion

[RacerXofFL]

Ok heres a pic of 5th gear sub 1000rpm



Wheelspin
]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fjd56n0nPCI&eurl=]

Slow launch
]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4mMYgwjkm9U&eurl=]

3,4,5 @ 60mph
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDHT3iiv2r4&eurl=


Ok so ppl wanted to see my fucked up gears, here ya go. Keep in mind these are very crowed streets and Im holding a cellphone and driving... no passanger to assist...

so if we loosely say 1000=32-35mph, and I can turn 6600 that would be between 211-231

[LiVn_It_UP]

Originally posted by c280nz
is that the same transmission as in a manual c280? m104?
can they handle some abuse can they?

transmission come out of a 94 E320 along with the engine (transmission is an automatic)

[RacerXofFL]

Originally posted by LiVn_It_UP
130 in 3rd would put you close to what 200mph in 5th?? love to see the video

I ran out tonight w/dome light on and cell in hand for you! and you ignore the gearing...

[c280nz]

i think he was talking about going that fast? which doesnt make sense either but meh.
must be good for fuel economy! how fast can you go in first?

[RacerXofFL]

1st gear top is 42, but if i pop the clutch at the right second it makes it to 45 lol

oh, btw i loose mpg in 5th, koz its full oad and has no vaccum so it goes to full fuel pressure where as its full vaccum in 4th...

I have plenty of gauges i can take pics for you, I immagine 5th @ 100 would be better then 4th tho...

only tested mpg in the city w/new motor, 22mpg adv

[c280nz]

yea theres quite a big bounce back on the rev limiter ant there :-) haha not that i know or anything. specially 3rd and 4th cutout
you needa get your ratios down tho, thats rediculus

[RacerXofFL]

I have a 3.27LSD in the garage, just no lift time, I used to have a 3.27 open with the 2.8 motor, now that I have the 3.2 im afraid im gona be slower in the 1320 koz of all the wheelspin...

[c280nz]

i woulda thought you woulda been faster because of the lsd?
ive been trying to track down one of those lsds with very little luck. but i am currently getting a flywheel made (was in the shop 2day helping my m8 out on the milling machine) the standard flyheel (dual mass) was 17kg, were aiming for 10kg or less<hopefully less. its gona be pritty on off clutch tho cos i dont have a sprung clutch plate

thats my rant over

[RacerXofFL]

that plus .050 off the pp mounting surface makes a light switch, I do not advise it.

I use a singelmass, like 45lbs, never weighed it.

[c280nz]

i can imagine, alota grap with those little puck clutches

[RacerXofFL]

yeah, rember how i said i HAD a 3.27 open, 4 days afterinstalling that clutch it blew up...

[omeyhomey]

i would not recommend single mass flywheel. run a lighter dual mass from the newer stick benzes. I must say those M104s do sound fantastic at high rpms.

[RacerXofFL]

I like the way it runs w/the single, I dont mind the weight, I has some idle problems, and a lighter flywheel wouldnt keep it idleing...

[omeyhomey]

Originally posted by RacerXofFL
I like the way it runs w/the single, I dont mind the weight, I has some idle problems, and a lighter flywheel wouldnt keep it idleing...

yes thats b/c in order to maintain idle u have to get new software to bump up idle about 100-200 rpm. Dual mass is there for numerous reasons, idle being one of them along with gearbox chatter.

[RacerXofFL]

fyi, my car has, and will soon again make more then double stock power numbers...

As soon as you start to increase the engine power over stock, or load the vehicle beyond design parameters, you run into problems. Dual mass flywheels are tuned systems and must be matched to the engine torque curve, engine resonant characteristics, vehicle load curves (including axle ratio/tire size calculations). They work by having a set of springs inserted between two rotating masses (thus dual mass). The springs are sized to soak up some of the resonant vibration from the diesel engine under load conditions. A dual mass fly wheel generally also contains an over torque friction release, so if it gets suddenly overloaded, rather than damage the springs, it slips. This works fine as a safety valve, but if it does it much it burns up. In short, overloaded they burn up and the springs get destroyed and they are worse than if it were a single mass FW.

[omeyhomey]

Originally posted by RacerXofFL
fyi, my car has, and will soon again make more then double stock power numbers...

As soon as you start to increase the engine power over stock, or load the vehicle beyond design parameters, you run into problems. Dual mass flywheels are tuned systems and must be matched to the engine torque curve, engine resonant characteristics, vehicle load curves (including axle ratio/tire size calculations). They work by having a set of springs inserted between two rotating masses (thus dual mass). The springs are sized to soak up some of the resonant vibration from the diesel engine under load conditions. A dual mass fly wheel generally also contains an over torque friction release, so if it gets suddenly overloaded, rather than damage the springs, it slips. This works fine as a safety valve, but if it does it much it burns up. In short, overloaded they burn up and the springs get destroyed and they are worse than if it were a single mass FW.

Yes i know that (basic101 stuff) the problem is NOT the dual mass, its the clutch. The E36 M3 guys run stock flywheel up to 400HP nearly 160HP above stock with no problems whatsoever. Clutch is what matters not the springs.

[c280nz]

i think your right there racerx with the additional hp you wish to make (and hopefully i will to at some stage) the standard dual mass wouldnt be up to it. and i dont have both the money or probebly the ability to track down a newer dual mass and then get it modified to fit my vehicle it would be to $$$

omeyhomey how heavy are the dual mass out of the newer benz?
i think that loosing weight off of my flywheel(hopefuly 5+ kg) should give a bit of a power increase and "free the reving up a bit" possibly let me accelerate faster in first and second gear.
you seem to know your stuff with your pulley making- any positive thoughts about it?

[omeyhomey]

typcially manufacturers have been making their flywheels lighter and lighter. I wouldn't be suprised if newer ones were 5-6lbs lighter. 95 M3 flywheels were 30lbs, and in 96+ they change them to 23lb flywheels so they revved up much quicker. If you do single mass flywheel though you cannot do crank pulley. Crank pulley is where the real power is in all gears. Lightweight flywheel only really helps in first and second gear. hope that helps.

[300EVO]

RacerXofFl, I have a 300E manual and was wondering what it took in the pedal box swap department? Did you use the W124/W201 pedals in the W202 or go full custom? If you used it, how close to bolt-in was it?
How about the manual shifter mounting, could you use the stock location & have the linkages line up?

[RacerXofFL]

I am using w201 pedals, the 4 booster bolt holes lined up, but the top firewall support did not. I bent a pice of steel and used 2 sets of nuts and bolts to fasten it. I do not recomend not using this top bolt, without it depressing the brake moves the entire booster.

This is of course the fit in a w202. Blind mounted the 124 pedals in his w201 with no issue. I can go look, I think my w201 pedals have w124 part numbers. I would need ot go look to verify, but w124 and w201 parts interswap all over the palce in this.

Blind has a w124 4 gate shifter in his w201

I have a W201 3 gate :P

Don

[blind26]

My pedals do in fact have a w124 part number and bolted straight to a 201... Like Racer was saying, you might just need to fab up a small bracket to make sure the assembly doesn't flex...

The shifter in the w202 lined up where the stock auto did, and if I remember correctly, w201 shift linkages were used...

[300EVO]

Cool, thanks for all the info. I have a '88 300E that's running the drivetrain from a '95 E320.......then I picked up an '86 5-speed car to donate manual swap parts.
My wife is getting a new '07 C-class soon so her '96 C280 Sport will be available......just weighing out some possibilities......W202 with 3.2 M104 & 300E 5-speed.....hmmm?

[Proven Guilty]

Originally posted by 300EVO
Cool, thanks for all the info. I have a '88 300E that's running the drivetrain from a '95 E320.......then I picked up an '86 5-speed car to donate manual swap parts.
My wife is getting a new '07 C-class soon so her '96 C280 Sport will be available......just weighing out some possibilities......W202 with 3.2 M104 & 300E 5-speed.....hmmm?

it's been done by a gentleman in miami, and he also used the LSD from the 300E.

turned out really nice, but you'll probably want to go stand alone fuel management, the ECU/TCU work is not plug and play as the fitment is..

[300EVO]

Originally posted by Proven Guilty
it's been done by a gentleman in miami, and he also used the LSD from the 300E.

turned out really nice, but you'll probably want to go stand alone fuel management, the ECU/TCU work is not plug and play as the fitment is..

Funny, my 300E 5-speed is from Miami.
Already been through the ECU swap when I put the M104 into the '88 but thanks for looking out!

[Proven Guilty]

Originally posted by 300EVO
Funny, my 300E 5-speed is from Miami.
Already been through the ECU swap when I put the M104 into the '88 but thanks for looking out!

if you surf the classifieds, you can find his post in there as well as search for the information regarding his build. perhaps you'll be able to iron out, or avoid some of the bugs through his process.

best of luck!