Curious to know.... can I turn my 99 c230 Kompressor into a C55?

[coolcarlskic43]

Originally posted by VIP_MBZ
I don't know the guy. Just something I saw.



Not really. If it were a simple swap, doable with an imported front clip, it might be ok, but because of drive by wire, it's not straight forward, unless you want to use the hard to find 1JZ-GTE VVT-i single turbo, or a 2JZ-GTE VVT-i out of a 99-00 JDM Supra or Aristo. Either way it's a lot of work and money on a car whose geometry is too screwed up (narrow rear end, unbalanced weight distribution, etc) to ever be competitive on the track with a 3rd or 4th gen Supra. In other words why have an illegal IS300 with a Supra motor when you can just have a legal daily driveable IS300 and a 3rd gen Supra. If you really really love the IS body style then you have to just bite the bullet, but understand that just like in the Mercedes scenario, you're spending inefficiently, and while the swap is taking place, or if it ever has to go down for tuning or any other reason, you have no other car to drive.

If you're getting mad and asking about details about that C220 on MBWorld, then you're clearly missing my point which is this: trying to turn a C230k into a high performance car can be done, but it is not a good value. By high performance, I'm talking about big turbo kits, motor buildups, and standalone fuel management. You will sacrifice the reason most people bought a C-class (luxury value), and at the end spend more than you would have had to if you started with a high performance platform. More power to anyone trying to go this route, but it is just simply not the most efficient use of money or a Mercedes. That's a fact, I don't see how you can possibly argue that.

-Ray

Mad about what! I'm asking for the details.

Value based on what you're saying is subjective .To each his own. I bought my C43 because of performance and value was a secondary issue...
I wonder why GLOW has two of the fastest turbocharged Solara's ever built!Hmmm, Luxury cars interesting. Funny thing is I also know a couple of turbocharged GS 300's as well.What are these guys thinking? Here's a dumb question!Ever heard of toyomoto?

[VIP_MBZ]

Originally posted by coolcarlskic43
Hmmm, Luxury cars interesting. Funny thing is I also know a couple of turbocharged GS 300's as well.What are these guys thinking? Here's a dumb question!Ever heard of toyomoto?

I'll tell you what they're thinking. They really love the chassis and they want it to go fast, and they don't care how much it costs.

I don't know how many times I have to say that if this is your feeling, then go for it. I've probably said that in every single one of my posts on this thread.

I'm just mentioning an alternative route to high performance if anyone is interested in achieving it with less money.

Yes I've heard of Toyomoto, but have not dealt with them personally. I have worked with Toysport on the west coast, and rather than turboing these cars we prefer to do the complete VVT-i 2JZ-GTE engine swap in the GS300 and full Supra 1JZ or 2JZ swap into the SC300. You get more power and less headaches. It's a better value. Sound familiar? For most people, money is an issue.

You can claim that you're not mad till you're blue in the face, but you're the one getting defensive when I'm just sharing information. If nobody is interested then I'll just keep it to myself from now on.

-Ray

[Under Pressure]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by coolcarlskic43

Originally posted by coolcarlskic43 A GT2535 is a garbage little turbo by the way.

Just so jstrat85 does not get offended when he reads this, since this turbo kit is now on his car, I will say this - that HKS GT2535 is the perfect size turbo to get a good spool on the small 2.2L motor of the C220. Plus its a ball-bearing turbo, so spool up is almost instant. It would not make much sense to put a T-88 into a C220. Plus I think the GT2535 is a modified Garrett AiResearch T-25, which is found (although in pairs instead of single) in the Lotus V8 Twin Turbo, the Lotus Carlton "Omega," and the Nissan 300ZX Twin Turbo. Its not a bad turbo at all!

[coolcarlskic43]

Originally posted by VIP_MBZ
I'll tell you what they're thinking. They really love the chassis and they want it to go fast, and they don't care how much it costs.

I don't know how many times I have to say that if this is your feeling, then go for it. I've probably said that in every single one of my posts on this thread.

I'm just mentioning an alternative route to high performance if anyone is interested in achieving it with less money.

Yes I've heard of Toyomoto, but have not dealt with them personally. I have worked with Toysport on the west coast, and rather than turboing these cars we prefer to do the complete VVT-i 2JZ-GTE engine swap in the GS300 and full Supra 1JZ or 2JZ swap into the SC300. You get more power and less headaches. It's a better value. Sound familiar? For most people, money is an issue.

You can claim that you're not mad till you're blue in the face, but you're the one getting defensive when I'm just sharing information. If nobody is interested then I'll just keep it to myself from now on.

-Ray

The Non vvt motor makes more power from what many many say.The 1jz is definitely not popular over here.
Neither are the 86-92 supras,been there done that!.

Yes Toyomoto does the same exact 2jz-gte swaps in the sc300 and gs300.It's also a better value to you!


You can chk out their web site.Lance is the man!
Why do you think it would cost hundreds and thousands of dollars to mod a c230k coupe! I mean go figure.

I don't see what would be taken away from the C230k coupe if it was modded with a nice turbocharger and front mount.It sure does 'nt take away from E36 or E46 BMW M3's.Many are turbocharged like the old EVO 190E 2.3L-16v car was as well as the diesels putting out well over 400rwhp.Using Holset turbos.

Bottom line dude.When it's all said and done you're entitled to your opinions.no big deal.Only when I think someone is coming from a non experiential point of view when it comes to a specific auto do I push like this. But i'm certainly not angry.

[coolcarlskic43]

Originally posted by Under Pressure
Just so jstrat85 does not get offended when he reads this, since this turbo kit is now on his car, I will say this - that HKS GT2535 is the perfect size turbo to get a good spool on the small 2.2L motor of the C220. Plus its a ball-bearing turbo, so spool up is almost instant. It would not make much sense to put a T-88 into a C220. Plus I think the GT2535 is a modified Garrett AiResearch T-25, which is found (although in pairs instead of single) in the Lotus V8 Twin Turbo, the Lotus Carlton "Omega," and the Nissan 300ZX Twin Turbo. Its not a bad turbo at all!

Yea ,quick spool up and no topend power.That's the ticket!

I have a Garrett T3/T4 60 trim on my 2.0L 4g63.The GT2535 is the last Turbo I 'd ever put on my modded 2.0L 4cyl.Now a Holset turbo HX40/35 hybrid going on my 2.oL.Even bigger.Very little Lag.My talon thrashes all the above cars you mentioned with that GT turbo installed.If it's nit a GT35r I don't wanna see it.honda guys are using bigger turbos than that.

No offense to Jstrat but I'd use a bigger turbo and make sure I have all the supporting mods for it.:

[coolcarlskic43]

Originally posted by VIP_MBZ


You can claim that you're not mad till you're blue in the face, but you're the one getting defensive when I'm just sharing information. If nobody is interested then I'll just keep it to myself from now on.

-Ray

Jeez talk about getting defensive!

[Under Pressure]

I'm sure jstrat85 doesnt drive 150mph very often, so maybe quick spool up would be a better trade off. But what do I know, I'm in idiot. I wouldnt trade off that $2,400 turbo if I were him.

GT2535 Turbocharger
Ball Bearing.
Watercooled.
Turbine Housing: 0.64a/r.
Compressor Housing: 0.70a/r.
Internally Wastegated.
Rated: 380hp.
Flange: T25/T28

[coolcarlskic43]

Originally posted by Under Pressure
I'm sure jstrat85 doesnt drive 150mph very often, so maybe quick spool up would be a better trade off. But what do I know, I'm in idiot. I wouldnt trade off that $2,400 turbo if I were him.

GT2535 Turbocharger
Ball Bearing.
Watercooled.
Turbine Housing: 0.64a/r.
Compressor Housing: 0.70a/r.
Internally Wastegated.
Rated: 380hp.
Flange: T25/T28

My car 413awhp 500crank hp.

[Under Pressure]

Originally posted by coolcarlskic43
My car 413awhp 500crank hp.

I respectfully seem to have missed your point (i.e., why are you telling me your car's output)? I was just pointing out to the capabilities of the GT2535. The turbo can generate 380hp at full boost (and add to that what the C220 can make on motor). Admit it, its not a bad turbo

[VIP_MBZ]

Originally posted by coolcarlskic43
The Non vvt motor makes more power from what many many say.
Yes Toyomoto does the same exact 2jz-gte swaps in the sc300 and gs300.It's also a better value to you!

I'm sorry I didn't clarify. I assumed late model 98-00 SC300 and 98-05 GS300, which are both drive by wire. The VVT-i is the direct swap for these years. The non-VVTi 2JZ is the direct replacement on first gen GS300 and early SC300 (92-97) and is said to be more mod friendly.

Why do you think it would cost hundreds and thousands of dollars to mod a c230k coupe! I mean go figure.

Just going by what other members have spent. Show me a 400 rwhp C230 that has less than $10k in mods.

I don't see what would be taken away from the C230k coupe if it was modded with a nice turbocharger and front mount.

I don't consider it luxury anymore when it has an open exhaust, something required to make big power out of a forced induction car. Also gutting the interior to lose weight (something that was mentioned earlier in this thread). This is my opinion of course, and I understand that some may be ok with it.

Only when I think someone is coming from a non experiential point of view when it comes to a specific auto do I push like this.

Think what you like, I've already made big power on a budget, and have helped many friends do the same. Just trying to share.

-Ray

[coolcarlskic43]

Originally posted by Under Pressure
I respectfully seem to have missed your point (i.e., why are you telling me your car's output)? I was just pointing out to the capabilities of the GT2535. The turbo can generate 380hp at full boost (and add to that what the C220 can make on motor). Admit it, its not a bad turbo

You are quoting 380hp at full boost on that tiny lil garrett on a 2.3 or 1.8L motor and I'm telling you I'm getting 413whp on a T3T4 Garrett turbo not at full boost on a 2.0L motor. 380 crank HP vs 413whp on two different turbos on motors using the same displacement is a BIG difference.That's my point.

[coolcarlskic43]

and

Originally posted by VIP_MBZ




Just going by what other members have spent. Show me a 400 rwhp C230 that has less than $10k in mods.



I don't consider it luxury anymore when it has an open exhaust, something required to make big power out of a forced induction car. Also gutting the interior to lose weight (something that was mentioned earlier in this thread). This is my opinion of course, and I understand that some may be ok with it.



Think what you like, I've already made big power on a budget, and have helped many friends do the same. Just trying to share.

-Ray

Sure , members who have spent $$ having someone do the install for them. First off the turbo,intercooler pipes and intercooler are not gonna run you anywhere near 10k.Finally building an exh mani+downpipe and then purchasing a standalone or reprogramming the stck ME software in the MB ECU is not gonna run you anywhere near 10k.

Yes when the C230k coupe Turbo is finally finished after final reprogramming I will show you that it didnt cost 10k to mod it to get 400rwhp.


If you know about modding the C230k coupe by experience then I have nothing to say ,but being that YOU personally have never turbocharged any MB in your life I'd assume,I continue with saying that you don't know what your talking about and the Toyota's are your department.Not to mention that I've owned them myself.

Amazing how I can turbocharge a E36 M3 with a kit for 6800.00 and get 500+ whp and you seem to think it's gonna cost more to get the MB at 400rwhp.Go figure!

Just for your info it did'nt even cost me more than 5500.00 to give my Eagle Talon 413whp and everything was done custom.

So I guess because I have a cat back on my C43 with a 5.5l motor and a full exhaust on my BMW M3 and M332i they are'nt considered luxury cars any more in your opinion? Give me a break! And when did I ever mention gutting the interior.Gutted,exhaust or not an MB is an MB and WORLD WIDE it would be considered a modded LUXURY Car in this case.!


Final note, it was nice to modd the 7mgte motor but in the end they just keep blowing up.One after another!


How many people can afford to mod and drop a 2jz into a 86-90 Supra. Tranny,diff,driveshaft wiring harness etc etc.This is how I would do it if I'm gonna do it properly.


It is known that dropping that motor(2jz-Gte) in a BMW M3 which is widely known comes out to more than 10k with someone who knows what they are doing to install it.


Believe me it gets quite expensive to mod that 15-19 yr old car with that motor and supporting components. I also state again I would never ever ever consider using that 2.5L 1jz motor.

Are you also telling me that there is more value and it's cheaper converting a 15-19yr old Supra like this vs modding a 2k-2005 C230kcoupe? I don't think so but to each his own.

[Under Pressure]

With such attitude I would have thought you drive a 2005 C55 instead of a 1998. jstrat85's C220 has a tranny and engine that cant even handle 380hp full boost + motor hp (~520hp combined) so why should he upgrade turbo when the one he has now make plenty of power. Whats the point if he continues to run 6psi? His turbo is fine for his application, I have made my point, and will not argue like we are in www.mbworld.org

[VIP_MBZ]

Originally posted by coolcarlskic43
Yes when the C230k coupe Turbo is finally finished after final reprogramming I will show you that it didnt cost 10k to mod it to get 400rwhp.

Ok, and at that time I will stand corrected.

So I guess because I have a cat back on my C43 with a 5.5l motor and a full exhaust on my BMW M3 and M332i they are'nt considered luxury cars any more in your opinion?

How much did the 55 conversion run you again? I'm not the only who feels this way, there's another thread asking why spend so much with so little return.

And when did I ever mention gutting the interior.

This may come as a shock to you, but I never intended to address you alone. Someone else mentioned it.

Final note, it was nice to modd the 7mgte motor but in the end they just keep blowing up.One after another!

That's because the 7M-GTE is a heap. I don't recall ever supporting this motor. It costs less to do a 2.5L swap than to build up the 7M, and at the end of the day the 1JZ will make more power and not break.

How many people can afford to mod and drop a 2jz into a 86-90 Supra. Tranny,diff,driveshaft wiring harness etc etc.This is how I would do it if I'm gonna do it properly.

Apples to apples, you're talking about doing a C230k on your own, so I'm not paying myself for labor on the Toyota either. Complete 2JZ assembly is only $4500 including turbos, accessories, harness, and ECU. Harness requires mild modification but doesn't really cost anything. We stay with the R154 5-speed in the 3rd gen because it can handle the power and comes with the car already. So no need for new tranny and driveshaft. Our last 2JZ into a mk3 customer was charged $11k including our labor, HKS cams, HKS cam gears, HKS fmic, HKS f-con v, and his desire to chrome everything. The only supporting mods are the JZA80 fuel pump ($200), bellhousing ($300), and
a decent clutch ($500). Everything else came with the $4500.

Believe me it gets quite expensive to mod that 15-19 yr old car with that motor and supporting components. I also state again I would never ever ever consider using that 2.5L 1jz motor.

That's funny, the 1JZ is just a short stroke version of the 2JZ (71.5mm stroke instead of 86mm), and is otherwise almost identical. Not as torquey as big brother, but can still hold 600 rwhp on stock internals, and can rev past 7k right out of the box. Couple that with the fact that you can get a 1JZ longblock for under $1k or a full 2.5L Supra front clip for under $2k, making it an awesome deal. The only reason mine has forged pistons is because I got a good deal from Arias, and now it will hold more power than I'm interested in producing.

The greatest thing is that if you already own a 1JZ and you want to go 3.0L, you can just buy a brand new 2JZ shortblock from the dealer ($2200) and transfer your accessories over and then bam, you have a 2JZ-GTE with true twins and a better flowing head..

Gutted,exhaust or not an MB is an MB and WORLD WIDE it would be considered a modded LUXURY Car in this case.!

Recognition is fine and all that, I'm not telling anyone what to do. Just providing a reminder that most of us probably bought the car for the comfort of its full interior and civil exhaust note. If not, then go for it. If you insist on sticking with this chassis, then go for it. But there are other less expensive platforms out there which cast those things to the wind already so you don't have to. How does providing that food for thought warrant the barrage I'm getting? To not bring up an alternative idea would defeat the purpose of this forum.

-Ray

[coolcarlskic43]

Originally posted by Under Pressure
With such attitude I would have thought you drive a 2005 C55 instead of a 1998. jstrat85's C220 has a tranny and engine that cant even handle 380hp full boost + motor hp (~520hp combined) so why should he upgrade turbo when the one he has now make plenty of power. Whats the point if he continues to run 6psi? His turbo is fine for his application, I have made my point, and will not argue like we are in www.mbworld.org

he 's not making 380hp running only 6lbs of boost.Trust me!

[coolcarlskic43]

Originally posted by VIP_MBZ



How much did the 55 conversion run you again? I'm not the only who feels this way, there's another thread asking why spend so much with so little return.




-Ray

The motor cost me 5k and labor to install was 1500.00. 6500.00 total. Does that mean I spent too much money?Wow when I sell the 4.3L AMG motor,let's say 3-3500.00 ,the whole job would have cost me say 3k soup to nuts!Like I sad it's all on knowing how to spend the $$ and on what!!!

And I'm just curious to find out what you mean by so little in return?It's obvious that the guy who made the comment did'nt have a clue.The 4.3L vs the 5.5L app is NO comparrison.To supercharge the 4.3L whether I went with HPS,Kleeman,or Renntech would have easily have run me 6500.00 to 15k+ dollars.Where's the savings and the value junk you've been stressing?

Amazing how I went from a car that runs 14.3 to 14.7 secs in the 1/4 mile to one that can now run Low 13's to high 12's.

Man! So litttle in return.

[J Irwan]

Guys...

lets keep any personal attack under the blankets..

lets just get along...
We are here to shared information and at time opinions may conflict one another, but don't let it get to you and ruin the mood and focus....

The original intend of this thread is to explore whether it is cost feasible and wise to do conversion of 99 C230K (W202) to C55 (5.4L V-8) engines..


lets not get distracted and back to the topic..

IMO
There are many things and consideration that would be considered best mod, best bang for the buck. And all of that is relative on how much you'd be willing to spent.. (anyway I am not going to continue...blabing on this topic as well).


Let's keep this thread clean..!!!


Regardz.

[coolcarlskic43]

Originally posted by J Irwan
Guys...

lets keep any personal attack under the blankets..

lets just get along...
We are here to shared information and at time opinions may conflict one another, but don't let it get to you and ruin the mood and focus....

The original intend of this thread is to explore whether it is cost feasible and wise to do conversion of 99 C230K (W202) to C55 (5.4L V-8) engines..


lets not get distracted and back to the topic..

IMO
There are many things and consideration that would be considered best mod, best bang for the buck. And all of that is relative on how much you'd be willing to spent.. (anyway I am not going to continue...blabing on this topic as well).


Let's keep this thread clean..!!!


Regardz.

OK you got it!

One more thing I'd like to add though!

Here is the post from the thread:

Originally posted by albanianbenz
I was just wondering why people are swapping in the e55 motor into their c43? Obviously for performance but you can exceed those numbers w/ either a custom turbo or one of the superchargers made for c43. And cost would most likely be a lot less.
Maybe I am missing something or dont have the right numbers, please inform me if I am mistaken.

What custom Turbo kit do they have for the C43? The only S/C kit that would make a lil more power than the 5.5L swap would be to spend 12-15k on a Klee kit or Renn kit.Looks like twice to 5 times what I spent!



This is what gets frustrating ,when folks make comments from the top of their heads without doing proper research and then posting it! But hold on ,at the end of his comments I 'll give him credit where he says to correct him if he's wrng for not having the right #'s.He clearly admits that!


OK J .you're right and I'm done!

[Pagz]

hey slammed....
thought i might just add a few cents....
IMO i think stay with the 230K engine....and swap to turbo or vortech,install a better IC and possibly later on upgrade fuel an ECU....and if your as keen as i think you are go for some mild cams and a light working on the head flow...

man i got a price for a C230 crank pully of my parts suppliers...700NZD....lol think ill go to the reckers for that part,or get a custom alloy one made if its possible.
laters...

Paul

[SLAMMED_C]

Originally posted by 23K
hey slammed....
thought i might just add a few cents....
IMO i think stay with the 230K engine....and swap to turbo or vortech,install a better IC and possibly later on upgrade fuel an ECU....and if your as keen as i think you are go for some mild cams and a light working on the head flow...
man i got a price for a C230 crank pully of my parts suppliers...700NZD....lol think ill go to the reckers for that part,or get a custom alloy one made if its possible.
laters...
Paul

Yeh for sure.. it only makes so much sense for me to stick with the M111 block and tune it.
Im for sure going to have to look into another SC or look at turbo's, I think I wanna stick with a SC.. but of course will still consider a turbo..
just a matter of how much things will cost!!!